Legislature(1999 - 2000)

02/03/2000 08:04 AM House STA

Audio Topic
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
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             HOUSE STATE AFFAIRS STANDING COMMITTEE                                                                             
                        February 3, 2000                                                                                        
                            8:04 a.m.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS PRESENT                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Representative Jeannette James, Chair                                                                                           
Representative Joe Green                                                                                                        
Representative Jim Whitaker                                                                                                     
Representative Bill Hudson                                                                                                      
Representative Beth Kerttula                                                                                                    
Representative Hal Smalley                                                                                                      
Representative Scott Ogan                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS ABSENT                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
All members present                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
COMMITTEE CALENDAR                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
HOUSE BILL NO. 230                                                                                                              
"An  Act   granting  certain   dispatchers   in  police   or  fire                                                              
departments  or for the  state troopers  status as peace  officers                                                              
under the public  employees' retirement system;  and providing for                                                              
an effective date."                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
     - MOVED CSHB 230(STA) OUT OF COMMITTEE                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
HOUSE BILL NO. 315                                                                                                              
"An  Act relating  to  elimination  of the  Alaska  Administrative                                                              
Journal and instituting  public notice requirements  on the Alaska                                                              
Online Public  Notice System;  amending public notice  publication                                                              
requirements  for  certain  regulations;   and  providing  for  an                                                              
effective date."                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     - MOVED HB 315 OUT OF COMMITTEE                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
PREVIOUS ACTION                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
BILL: HB 230                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE: PERS BENEFITS FOR POLICE/FIRE DISPATCHERS                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Jrn-Date    Jrn-Page           Action                                                                                           
 5/07/99      1228     (H)  READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRAL(S)                                                                   
 5/07/99      1228     (H)  STA, FIN                                                                                            
 2/03/00               (H)  STA AT  8:00 AM CAPITOL 102                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
BILL: HB 315                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE: ONLINE SYSTEM REPLACES AK ADMIN JOURNAL                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
Jrn-Date    Jrn-Page           Action                                                                                           
 1/24/00      1988     (H)  READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                     
 1/24/00      1988     (H)  STA                                                                                                 
 1/24/00      1988     (H)  ZERO FISCAL NOTE (GOV)                                                                              
 1/24/00      1988     (H)  GOVERNOR'S TRANSMITTAL LETTER                                                                       
 1/24/00      1988     (H)  REFERRED TO STATE AFFAIRS                                                                           
 2/03/00               (H)  STA AT  8:00 AM CAPITOL 102                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
WITNESS REGISTER                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
PATRICK HARMAN, Legislative Administrative Assistant                                                                            
  to Representative Pete Kott                                                                                                   
Alaska State Legislature                                                                                                        
Capitol Building, Room 118                                                                                                      
Juneau, Alaska  99801                                                                                                           
POSITION STATEMENT:  Presented sponsor statement for HB 230.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
GUY BELL, Director                                                                                                              
Division of Retirement & Benefits                                                                                               
Department of Administration                                                                                                    
PO Box 110203                                                                                                                   
Juneau, Alaska 99811-0203                                                                                                       
POSITION STATEMENT:  Provided department's position and answered                                                                
questions regarding HB 230.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
BILL CHURCH, Retirement Supervisor                                                                                              
Division of Retirement & Benefits                                                                                               
Department of Administration                                                                                                    
PO Box 110203                                                                                                                   
Juneau, Alaska 99811-0203                                                                                                       
POSITION STATEMENT:  Provided department's position and answered                                                                
questions regarding HB 230.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
JEAN BOWMAN                                                                                                                     
Palmer Police Department                                                                                                        
423 S. Valley Way                                                                                                               
Palmer, Alaska 99645                                                                                                            
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in favor of HB 230.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
DUANE UDLAND, Chief                                                                                                             
Anchorage Police Department                                                                                                     
Municipality of Anchorage                                                                                                       
PO Box 196650                                                                                                                   
Anchorage, Alaska 99519                                                                                                         
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in favor of HB 230.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
BETTY CONKLIN, Jail Officer                                                                                                     
Sitka Police Department                                                                                                         
100 Lincoln Street                                                                                                              
Sitka, Alaska 99835                                                                                                             
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in  favor of HB 230.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
TAMRYN BOND                                                                                                                     
Valdez Police Department                                                                                                        
PO Box 307                                                                                                                      
Valdez, Alaska 99966                                                                                                            
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in  favor of HB 230.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
NANCY BUCKMASTER, Animal Control Officer                                                                                        
Sitka Police Department                                                                                                         
PO Box 6081                                                                                                                     
Sitka, Alaska 99835                                                                                                             
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in  favor of HB 230.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
DEL SMITH, Deputy Commissioner                                                                                                  
Department of Public Safety                                                                                                     
PO Box 111200                                                                                                                   
Juneau, Alaska 99811-1200                                                                                                       
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in  favor of HB 230.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
KAREN CHILDERS, Communications Supervisor                                                                                       
Juneau Police Department                                                                                                        
4103 Blackerby St.                                                                                                              
Juneau, Alaska 99801                                                                                                            
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in  favor of HB 230.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
PAM PROVOST                                                                                                                     
Anchorage Police Department                                                                                                     
PO Box 772534                                                                                                                   
Eagle River, Alaska 99577                                                                                                       
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in  favor of HB 230.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
CONNIE HETTINGA                                                                                                                 
Anchorage Police Department                                                                                                     
19120 Lakina                                                                                                                    
Eagle River, Alaska 99577                                                                                                       
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in  favor of HB 230.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
JULIE KRAFFT, Director of Member Services                                                                                       
Alaska Municipal League                                                                                                         
217 Second St.                                                                                                                  
Juneau, Alaska 99801                                                                                                            
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified against HB 230.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
KIM MARTIN                                                                                                                      
Juneau Police Department                                                                                                        
210 Admiral Way                                                                                                                 
Juneau, Alaska 99801                                                                                                            
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in favor of HB 230.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
JOSEPH CROSS, Communications Supervisor                                                                                         
Dillingham Police Department                                                                                                    
PO Box 889                                                                                                                      
Dillingham, Alaska 99576                                                                                                        
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in favor of HB 230.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
JOHN LINDBACK, Chief of Staff                                                                                                   
Office of the Lieutenant Governor                                                                                               
PO Box 110015                                                                                                                   
Juneau, Alaska 99811-0015                                                                                                       
POSITION STATEMENT:  Presented sponsor statement for HB 315.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
ACTION NARRATIVE                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
TAPE 00-3, SIDE A                                                                                                               
Number 0001                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  JEANNETTE JAMES  called the  House  State Affairs  Standing                                                              
Committee meeting  to order at 8:04  a.m.  Members present  at the                                                              
call  to order  were  Representatives  James, Green,  Smalley  and                                                              
Ogan.   Representatives Hudson, Kerttula  and Whitaker  arrived as                                                              
the meeting was in progress.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
HB 230-PERS BENEFITS FOR POLICE/FIRE DISPATCHERS                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
Number 0013                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR JAMES  announced the first  order of business is  HOUSE BILL                                                              
NO. 230,  "An Act granting certain  dispatchers in police  or fire                                                              
departments  or for the  state troopers  status as peace  officers                                                              
under the public  employees' retirement system;  and providing for                                                              
an effective date."  She indicated  there was a proposed committee                                                              
substitute.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GREEN   made  a  motion  to  adopt   the  proposed                                                              
committee  substitute  for  HB 230,  version  1-LS0958/D,  Cramer,                                                              
1/11/00,  as a work  draft.   There being  no objection,  proposed                                                              
CSHB 230, Version D, was before the committee.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
Number 0126                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
PATRICK   HARMAN,   Legislative    Administrative   Assistant   to                                                              
Representative Kott, read the following sponsor statement:                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     House Bill  230 will require  all dispatchers  under the                                                                   
     Public Employees Retirement  System (PERS), who elect to                                                                   
     change   from  a   30-year  retirement   to  a   20-year                                                                   
     retirement,  to pay  the employees'  and the  employers'                                                                   
     contribution  of the  costs to  that 20-year  retirement                                                                   
     conversion.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     Approximately 263  employees of PERS employers  would be                                                                   
     affected   by   this  legislation.   Of   that   number,                                                                   
     approximately 45 are state employees.   The cost to each                                                                   
     employee   for  the  employee   contribution  would   be                                                                   
     approximately  $450 per year  of service under  the PERS                                                                   
     system.   The cost  for each  employee for the  employer                                                                   
     contribution would  be approximately an  additional $450                                                                   
     per year of  service under the PERS system.   That would                                                                   
     mean a  total cost  of approximately  $900 per year  for                                                                   
     years  of  service  under  the   PERS  system  for  each                                                                   
     employee that elects to change  retirement terms.  Under                                                                   
     this  legislation,  there  would   be  no  cost  to  the                                                                   
     employer  and all costs  would be  paid by the  employee                                                                   
     when he  or she voluntarily  elects to make  this change                                                                   
     in their own retirement system.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MR.   HARMAN   explained   that  the   citizens   who   approached                                                              
Representative Kott  regarding HB 230  are willing to pay  for the                                                              
service they  are requesting.   Due  to the  nature of their  jobs                                                              
[most  of them  are  police dispatchers],  they  suffer such  high                                                              
levels of  stress and  burnout that  very few  of them can  endure                                                              
until retirement  at 30  years of service.   Mr. Harman  expressed                                                              
the concern of  legislators that other state employees  would like                                                              
to be  included in  the scope  of HB 230,  but HB  230 has  a very                                                              
narrow title and only deals with  dispatchers.  If the legislature                                                              
wants to consider  other classes of employees, it  will have to be                                                              
done on a case-by-case basis.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Number 0315                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN  asked how the  legislature is going  to stop                                                              
other  state employees  from  requesting relief  from  job-related                                                              
stress in  the same manner  as the dispatchers.   The case  can be                                                              
stated that  many people  feel that their  jobs are stressful,  he                                                              
pointed out.  He  wants to make sure that HB  230 remains revenue-                                                              
neutral.   If  people retire  early -  such as  under the  20-year                                                              
retirement - somebody has to work  in their place.  After a while,                                                              
more  people  are  retired  than  working.    He  asked  how  that                                                              
situation can be revenue-neutral.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Number 0399                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MR. HARMAN  suggested that is  a matter of  public policy.   If an                                                              
employee  retires,  another  person  is  hired to  fill  the  open                                                              
position.   Since state  employees who  want a 20-year  retirement                                                              
rather than  a 30-year retirement  are willing  to pay for  it, he                                                              
does not see a difficulty in calculating  the cost.  There are two                                                              
aspects  of  being revenue-neutral  in  this  case:   one  is  the                                                              
operating  budget   and  the  other   is  a  long-term   fiduciary                                                              
responsibility  [making  sure the  fund  stays solvent]  that  the                                                              
state  would incur  on  retiring  employees.   The  intent of  the                                                              
proposed CS is to have both of those aspects be neutral.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Number 0481                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GREEN expressed  concern that  the committee  does                                                              
not have a fiscal  note for the proposed CS.  He  said he wants to                                                              
know whether the proposed CS is truly revenue-neutral.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Number 0563                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  JAMES  asked  for  clarification  regarding  an  employee's                                                              
retirement  contribution  on a  20-year  or a  30-year  retirement                                                              
program,  in  relation   to  the  state's  contribution   for  the                                                              
employee.                                                                                                                       
Number 0707                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
GUY BELL, Director, Division of Retirement  & Benefits, Department                                                              
of Administration,  said the proposed  CS shifts  dispatchers into                                                              
the police-fire  service category,  thus allowing them  the option                                                              
of using prior PERS service and full  payment of actuarial cost to                                                              
meet  police  service retirement  requirements.    Therefore,  the                                                              
proposed  CS is revenue-neutral  because  the employees make  full                                                              
actuarial  payment for  the police  service category  designation.                                                              
Once  police-fire service  category  is authorized,  the  employee                                                              
begins  to contribute  7.5  percent, instead  of  the normal  6.75                                                              
percent rate, to the retirement system.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
Number 0917                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
BILL  CHURCH,  Retirement  Supervisor, Division  of  Retirement  &                                                              
Benefits, Department of Administration,  indicated it is difficult                                                              
to predict the  actual cost in the future.   Both the Municipality                                                              
of  Anchorage and  the  State of  Alaska  have  separate rates  of                                                              
retirement contribution for police-fire.   The fiscal note for the                                                              
proposed CS indicates the difference in the contribution rate.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR JAMES  indicated that  her previous  question to  Mr. Harman                                                              
had been  answered satisfactorily  by officials in  the Department                                                              
of  Administration.    She  inquired  as to  the  benefits  of  an                                                              
employee  remaining  20  years  as  opposed  to  15  years,  since                                                              
employees feel 30  years [in this type of employment]  is too long                                                              
to wait.  Chair  James also inquired as to the  benefits of having                                                              
experienced  folks on  the job.   Those  are cost  items that  the                                                              
committee members realize exist,  but there is no way of measuring                                                              
their cost.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Number 1080                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MR. CHURCH reviewed  the history of the police-fire  category.  In                                                              
1962, the  definition of fireman  or policeman included  employees                                                              
who were  firemen, policemen, guards  at public institutions,  and                                                              
fire wardens.  In 1975, correctional  officers/superintendents and                                                              
fish and  game biologists/technicians  were  added to the  police-                                                              
fire category.   That  was the  first time  the category  departed                                                              
from just including those employees  involved in fighting fire and                                                              
crime.   In 1983, the legislature  changed the  statute definition                                                              
by  removing  fish   and  game  employees  from   the  police-fire                                                              
category.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MR.   BELL  explained   that   two   other  groups   are   seeking                                                              
authorization  by  legislative  mandate to  join  the  police-fire                                                              
category:     correctional  institution  employees   who  are  not                                                              
correctional officers, and youth  correctional counselors employed                                                              
by the Department  of Health and Social Services.   Allowing these                                                              
groups and the  dispatchers to join the police-fire  category will                                                              
increase that category by 30 percent.   He noted that all teachers                                                              
are part of the "20 and out" retirement plan.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Number 1294                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN asked if teachers  also pay a higher employee                                                              
retirement contribution rate, as do police-fire employees.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MR. CHURCH answered that teachers  pay 8.65 percent into their "20                                                              
and  out" retirement  plan  because  they  belong to  a  different                                                              
category than police-fire employees.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN  asked if current dispatcher  employees would                                                              
pay the higher  police-fire rate retroactively if  the proposed CS                                                              
passed.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
Number 1335                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MR. BELL  replied by reading the  following from the  proposed CS:                                                              
"an employee who was employed as  a dispatcher ... may convert the                                                              
credited service for that position  to credited service as a peace                                                              
officer  by claiming  the service  as a peace  officer before  the                                                              
member is appointed to retirement."   He said an employee can make                                                              
that choice at any point before retirement and pay the cost.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GREEN asked  if the  employee  also paid  interest                                                              
when paying for the cost of joining the police-fire category.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
MR.  BELL answered  yes.   He directed  members to  page 2,  which                                                              
states:    "When  the  member  claims  this  retroactive  credited                                                              
service,  an indebtedness  of the  member to the  system shall  be                                                              
established.   The  indebtedness is  equal to  the full  actuarial                                                              
cost  of  the  conversion  of  the  credited  service  ...."    He                                                              
explained that  the actuarial cost  means principal  and interest,                                                              
and it applies to both the employer and employee portions.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
Number 1435                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN  mentioned that Administration  officials had                                                              
indicated that  the police-fire  category was originally  intended                                                              
for those people who are risking  their lives in the line of duty.                                                              
He  acknowledged  that dispatchers  suffer  high  stress in  their                                                              
jobs; however,  are  they risking  their lives?   In addition,  he                                                              
asked for  an Administration opinion  as to how many  other groups                                                              
of employees would also claim high  stress as reason for joining a                                                              
"20 and out" retirement program.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MR. BELL recognized that there is  a risk for dispatchers and they                                                              
do work  high-stress jobs.  Other  state and local  city employees                                                              
also  experience high  stress, both  emotional and  physical.   He                                                              
agreed  that other groups  could  come forward  and make the  same                                                              
argument as the dispatchers.  There  is history in other states of                                                              
other groups being included in the police-fire category.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Number 1580                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR JAMES admitted that she has  been negative regarding 20-year                                                              
retirements because  it seems like a loss of expertise  at a young                                                              
age.   However,  people  can have  three or  four  careers in  one                                                              
lifetime.    She  believes  every  job is  stressful,  but  it  is                                                              
difficult to measure because it depends  on who is being measured.                                                              
She agreed  that stress does shorten  lives and is a  valid issue.                                                              
She  is pleased  that the  dispatchers  requesting the  additional                                                              
benefit are willing to pay for the added cost, she concluded.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Number 1735                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  KERTTULA voiced  her understanding  that the  only                                                              
cost to  the state  under the  proposed CS  would be an  increased                                                              
employer rate to match the higher employee contribution rate.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
MR. BELL affirmed that.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  JAMES reminded  the committee  that  employees who  qualify                                                              
under  the proposed  CS are  not  just state  employees.   Private                                                              
employers  will also  be obliged  to  pay their  employees at  the                                                              
higher rate.   She surmised that  the legislature would  hear from                                                              
some employers regarding  this issue because it is,  in effect, an                                                              
unfunded mandate.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  HUDSON  asked  whether there  is  an  identifiable                                                              
impact on   retirement funds.   He always understood  that police,                                                              
fire,  and  correctional  employees  were  given a  "20  and  out"                                                              
retirement because  of the  risk to life  in their jobs,  he said.                                                              
This is the first time he has heard  about stress as being a major                                                              
factor in deciding on retirement.   He wondered if there are other                                                              
job positions in  the state where employees might  reasonably come                                                              
forward and claim  stress as a reason for being included  in a "20                                                              
and out" retirement program instead  of remaining with the current                                                              
30-year program.   He recognized that  "20 and out" does  not cost                                                              
the general  fund anything but again  asked if there are  costs to                                                              
the retirement fund.                                                                                                            
Number 1931                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MR.  BELL answered  that  theoretically,  as  the proposed  CS  is                                                              
written,  it  will  not  negatively  affect  the  retirement  fund                                                              
because the person  who is given the "20 and out"  option must pay                                                              
the full  actuarial cost and thus  effectively make the  PERS fund                                                              
whole.   If a large  number of people  were placed in  the police-                                                              
fire category,  it would cause higher employer  contribution rates                                                              
in the future to  all employers in that category.   He stated that                                                              
the retirement  system pays for the  higher cost by  collecting an                                                              
extra contribution from the employee.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Number 2029                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON  said he believes almost any  state employee                                                              
who works  in a stressful  situation could  make the same  case as                                                              
the dispatchers.   He asked  why not  revert to a 20-year  program                                                              
for everybody if  it does not cost the state any  money and if the                                                              
employee is willing to pay the difference.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MR. BELL  answered that  if the  20-year program  were applied  to                                                              
everybody  in  state service,  fund  rates  of the  program  would                                                              
increase significantly.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR JAMES mentioned  a policy question of expertise  on the job.                                                              
She asked  if more folks who  are dispatchers will stay  longer on                                                              
the  job  to  reach  "20 and  out."    She  recommended  retaining                                                              
employees on  the job for  a longer period  of time  because good,                                                              
experienced employees  are valuable, providing they  do not become                                                              
stressed and unproductive.   She agreed that there  is much stress                                                              
everywhere,  whether  people  are in  a  workplace  or not.    She                                                              
acknowledged  that sometimes  stress levels  demand a job  change.                                                              
Therefore, she envisions  being able to carry  one's retirement to                                                              
the  next  job;  she  believes  portable  retirement  systems  are                                                              
extremely important  in today's  system.  On  the other  hand, the                                                              
legislature  is  committed  to  keeping   government  costs  under                                                              
control  because that  is what the  public wants.   She  cautioned                                                              
that the  public is watching  the outcome  of HB 230  because even                                                              
though they can  sympathize with the dispatchers,  the public also                                                              
suffers stress in  their jobs and yet do not have  the luxury of a                                                              
"20 and out" program.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR JAMES continued.   Each year the legislature  deposits money                                                              
into  the state  retirement system  to cover  change in  actuarial                                                              
costs to make the fund sound, she  noted.  It is clear to her that                                                              
actuarial money  earns interest for the retirement  fund; however,                                                              
if the national  economy worsens, she thinks the  legislature will                                                              
be required  to deposit  extra money into  the retirement  fund to                                                              
cover costs  for additional  people  under the  proposed CS.   She                                                              
feels  that  those kinds  of  extra  costs are  immeasurable,  she                                                              
concluded, and so the committee must make a policy call.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Number 2317                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  KERTTULA  expressed  her understanding  that  more                                                              
people being  added to  the retirement fund  would result  in more                                                              
money being  deposited that could be  used for investment.   It is                                                              
her opinion  that if  the investments  are good,  it results  in a                                                              
gain for the retirement fund.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Number 2335                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MR.  BELL agreed.    He stated  that the  retirement  fund is  now                                                              
earning  8.25  percent  on actuarial  money;  therefore,  employer                                                              
rates have decreased  because of the good return.   The PERS board                                                              
tries to keep employer rates as flat  as possible.  Inevitably, he                                                              
believes markets  will change resulting  in losses, which  will be                                                              
felt by  the retirement fund.   Obviously, the PERS  Board desires                                                              
to  protect  the retirement  fund  and  beneficiaries as  much  as                                                              
possible.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN  noted that Alaska has become  an older state                                                              
demographically.   He  wondered  if the  aging  population has  an                                                              
affect on actuarial  tables and what the Division  of Retirement &                                                              
Benefits sees in the future.  He  surmised that money flowing into                                                              
the retirement  fund now  will start to  flow out at  an increased                                                              
rate because of the aging population.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Number 2422                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MR. BELL  replied that the number  of retirees in Alaska  is going                                                              
to double over the next ten years,  and the Division of Retirement                                                              
& Benefits  does  take the  aging factor  into consideration  when                                                              
determining  actuarial  values.   He  agreed  with  Representative                                                              
Green that there will be cash flow  issues because the Division of                                                              
Retirement & Benefits will be paying out more money.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  JAMES  announced  that  the   committee  will  hear  public                                                              
testimony regarding the proposed CS.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
Number 2485                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
JEAN BOWMAN, representing the Palmer  Police Department, testified                                                              
via  teleconference   from  Palmer.     She  read   the  following                                                              
statement:                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     My name is  Jean Bowman and I have been  a dispatcher at                                                                   
     Palmer Police  Department since  May 1991.   We dispatch                                                                   
     Palmer City  Police, Wasilla City Police  and Matanuska-                                                                   
     Susitna Borough fire and ambulance services.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     Dispatchers   should   be  included   in   the   20-year                                                                   
     retirement  due to  the stress  level and  job burn  out                                                                   
     rate.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     We are the  personnel behind the scenes which  make us a                                                                   
     unique, integral  part of the  support mechanism  to law                                                                   
     enforcement.  We are the "first,"  first responders.  We                                                                   
     are the first  to receive the call, prioritize  when the                                                                   
     call   is  dispatched,   we   ascertain  all   pertinent                                                                   
     information  to assist  the  officer  responding to  the                                                                   
     call,  we  run records  check  on involved  parties  for                                                                   
     officer  safety, relaying this  information while  he or                                                                   
     she is responding.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
     Officers handle  one call at  a time, while  dispatchers                                                                   
     are handling the call they sent  the officer to, as well                                                                   
     as continuing to answer incoming  calls such as business                                                                   
     lines  to  include  911  calls.   Some  are  trained  as                                                                   
     emergency  medical  dispatchers [EMDs].    When the  911                                                                   
     call comes in, we have a zero-minute  response time.  By                                                                   
     using  protocols,  an EMD  can begin  providing  medical                                                                   
     assistance  immediately, only  seconds after  a call  is                                                                   
     received.   We  are also able  to do  both functions  of                                                                   
     evaluating  emergency medical calls  and caring  for the                                                                   
     patient until responders arrive.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
     By the end of a shift, we have  been exposed to anything                                                                   
     from  directions to  a location,  to someone  committing                                                                   
     suicide while  talking on the  phone with you,  domestic                                                                   
     violence  (DV) in  progress, or a  mother screaming  and                                                                   
     crying   that  her  six-month-old   child  has   stopped                                                                   
     breathing.   Dispatchers deal  with situations  that are                                                                   
     considered emergencies by the  callers.  We have to keep                                                                   
     our personal, human emotions  at bay and handle the call                                                                   
     and continue  to take phone calls and  dispatch officers                                                                   
     without  any indication of  stress.   We don't have  the                                                                   
     luxury of walking away to regroup  before the next call.                                                                   
     Day in and day out, we deal  with the most diverse types                                                                   
     of people, from nice to obnoxious.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
     What is critical-incident stress?   Dr. Jeffrey Mitchell                                                                   
     defines it as any situation  faced by emergency services                                                                   
     personnel  that  causes  them  to  experience  unusually                                                                   
     strong emotional  reactions which have the  potential to                                                                   
     interfere  with their  ability  at the  scene or  later;                                                                   
     generates  unusually strong  feelings  in the  emergency                                                                   
     service workers.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
     Who  are   emergency  services  personnel?     Emergency                                                                   
     service workers consist of those  individuals in service                                                                   
     to   their   communities  (volunteer   or   career)   as                                                                   
     firefighters,   police   officers,   emergency   medical                                                                   
     service,  nurses,   dispatchers,  emergency   management                                                                   
     personnel and others.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     Overall   and  over   time,  our   jobs  are   extremely                                                                   
     stressful.     Burnout  is   a  syndrome  of   physical,                                                                   
     emotional and mental exhaustion  brought on by severe or                                                                   
     chronic stress directly related to a job.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
MS. BOWMAN said  that personally she could see  herself working as                                                              
a  dispatcher for  20 years,  but  not for  30 years,  due to  the                                                              
stresses.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Number 2659                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GREEN  asked  Ms.   Bowman  about  her  work  week                                                              
schedule.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MS. BOWMAN answered that her work  schedule is a 40-hour work week                                                              
of five 8-hour days, but she is on  call.  If an employee calls in                                                              
sick or weather conditions are hazardous  for travel, a dispatcher                                                              
may have to work an 18-hour shift.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
Number 2704                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
DUANE UDLAND,  Chief, Anchorage  Police Department,  testified via                                                              
teleconference from Anchorage, noting  that he also represents the                                                              
Alaska  Association  of  Chiefs   of  Police.    He  believes  the                                                              
dispatcher position  has been overlooked.  In  his experience, the                                                              
Anchorage Police  Department must  recruit and screen  dispatchers                                                              
at  the same  level as  they do  for police  officers because  the                                                              
training  required for a  dispatcher is  about the  same as  for a                                                              
police officer.   He believes  "20 and  out" would be  helpful for                                                              
many agencies in retaining qualified dispatchers.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
MR.  UDLAND  informed  members  that   he  has  noticed  that  his                                                              
department has lost many successful  dispatchers when they realize                                                              
that they have 30 years of this type  of work ahead of them before                                                              
they can  retire.  Loss of  trained dispatchers results  in a real                                                              
dollar  cost  to  the  Anchorage   Police  Department.    Although                                                              
dispatchers do not  risk physical danger like  police officers do,                                                              
the psychological danger  is just as great.  Furthermore,  while a                                                              
police officer  might respond to  one or two emergencies  while on                                                              
duty, dispatchers deal with emergencies continually.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MR. UDLAND  emphasized the  importance of  making the proposed  CS                                                              
completely  revenue-neutral.    He  had  already  heard  that  the                                                              
[Alaska]  Municipal  League  would  oppose  HB  230  because  they                                                              
believe that any  cost passed on to municipalities  is an unfunded                                                              
mandate.  He suspects his own city  [Anchorage] might oppose a 2.5                                                              
percent increase in  employer contribution rate to a  "20 and out"                                                              
retirement program, he added.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Number 2825                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
BETTY CONKLIN,  Jail Officer,  Sitka Police Department,  testified                                                              
via teleconference  from Sitka.   She said that because  Alaska is                                                              
made  up  of  small  communities,  service  people  in  the  small                                                              
communities   perform many  tasks, though they  may have  only one                                                              
job title.   She  has seen dispatchers  in Sitka  help out  in the                                                              
jail,  for example.    She,  in turn,  has  had to  dispatch  when                                                              
circumstances warranted.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MS. CONKLIN  said she wants the  proposed CS to  include uniformed                                                              
public safety personnel.  She believes  the original intent of "20                                                              
and out" was not  just for stress, but for risk  to life and [risk                                                              
of]  injury.   She  felt  that she  could  get  "beaten  up" by  a                                                              
telephone caller  just as she could  get "beaten up" in  the jail.                                                              
She believes  all uniformed  public safety  personnel -  including                                                              
dispatchers, jail  officers, and animal control officers  - are at                                                              
risk.  She asked that the committee consider passage of HB 230.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Number 2896                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
TAMRYN   BOND,    Valdez   Police   Department,    testified   via                                                              
teleconference from  Valdez.  She said she is  concerned about the                                                              
correctional officer issue.  Valdez  Police Department dispatchers                                                              
are called upon sometimes to search  jail cells and perform female                                                              
strip searches and urinalysis tests.   She agreed with the witness                                                              
from Sitka  that dispatchers  in small  communities perform  other                                                              
duties besides dispatching.   She felt most dispatchers  would not                                                              
reach  30-year retirement  because  of the  burnout  factor.   She                                                              
believes the  police department could  retain more  dispatchers by                                                              
offering  a 20-year retirement  program  and still could  maintain                                                              
cost-effectiveness.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Number 2950                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
NANCY   BUCKMASTER,   Animal   Control   Officer,   Sitka   Police                                                              
Department,    testified  via teleconference  from  Sitka.    Even                                                              
though assigned to  animal control duties and  managing the animal                                                              
shelter, she still  takes 25 percent of the calls  that come in to                                                              
the police  department.   She wants the  proposed CS to  read "all                                                              
uniformed public safety personnel."                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
TAPE 00-3, SIDE B                                                                                                               
Number 2951                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
DEL  SMITH,  Deputy Commissioner,  Department  of  Public  Safety,                                                              
testified he had been employed by  the Anchorage Police Department                                                              
from 1968  to 1988.  He agreed  with Mr. Udland's  testimony about                                                              
the difficulty of the dispatcher's  task.  He does not recall ever                                                              
attending a 30-year retirement for  a police dispatcher, he noted.                                                              
He shares the dispatchers' concerns  because of the kinds of calls                                                              
they receive every  day; he believes it would be  hard to work for                                                              
30 years in that environment.  He  reminded the committee that the                                                              
difficulty of  the dispatcher job  requires the police  department                                                              
to  continually   recruit  and  train   new  dispatchers.     Many                                                              
dispatchers  who have reached  journeyman grade  move on  to other                                                              
PERS  positions because  it just  takes  too long  to qualify  for                                                              
retirement, while enduring difficult  job conditions.  He said the                                                              
proposed  CS  is  worthy  of  consideration  by  the  legislature.                                                              
Nevertheless, he is aware that others  feel that they also merit a                                                              
20-year  retirement   based  upon   their  job  conditions.     He                                                              
acknowledged that it is a policy  call for the committee to decide                                                              
upon.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Number 2848                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR JAMES asked a hypothetical  question as to whether Mr. Smith                                                              
would prefer to speak with a newly  hired dispatcher or a seasoned                                                              
dispatcher when he calls 911.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
MR.  SMITH  answered  that  he  would  prefer  to  speak  with  an                                                              
experienced person.  On the other  hand, he would not want to deal                                                              
with someone who does not care anymore.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GREEN  inquired as  to  the  average tenure  of  a                                                              
dispatcher.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MR. SMITH  said  he did not  know the  tenure, but  he guesses  it                                                              
might be between  five and ten years.  He acknowledged  that there                                                              
are some dispatchers approaching 20 years in the occupation.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Number 2769                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN  asked if "20  and out" would  really benefit                                                              
the dispatchers  for retention  purposes if  they feel  burnout at                                                              
about five to ten years.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MR. SMITH said he did not mean to  imply that at five to ten years                                                              
dispatchers  are  ready  to  "bail   out."    He  thinks  that  if                                                              
dispatchers can  see a large light  at the end of the  tunnel (20-                                                              
year  retirement)    rather  than a  pinpoint  of  light  (30-year                                                              
retirement), then they are  likely to remain on duty.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Number 2699                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN asked if keeping  a hardened, less empathetic                                                              
dispatcher for  ten more  years just to  reach "20 and  out" would                                                              
create more of a problem for public safety departments.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MR.  SMITH  said   he  hopes  it  would  not   create  a  problem.                                                              
Individuals  are  all different,  but  hopefully  the majority  of                                                              
dispatcher  employees would perform  well in  their jobs  and care                                                              
about what they do until they reach retirement.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Number 2630                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
KAREN CHILDERS, Communications Supervisor, Juneau Police                                                                        
Department, testified in favor of HB 230.  She read the following                                                               
statement:                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     Public safety dispatching  is a job like no  other.  The                                                                   
     nature  of the  job requires  technical,  communication,                                                                   
     multitasking  and interpersonal skills,  to name  only a                                                                   
     few.  What separates this job  from others requiring the                                                                   
     same skill  is that a  dispatcher must have  the ability                                                                   
     to disengage  their emotions in  order to do  what needs                                                                   
     to be done.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     During my 15  years as a dispatcher, I  have experienced                                                                   
     many stressful  and heartbreaking  incidents.   I recall                                                                   
     grieving,  in a  bathroom stall  while on  break, for  a                                                                   
     woman  who  found  her  baby   drowned  in  her  pool  -                                                                   
     hysterical  and begging over  the phone  for me to  save                                                                   
     her child.   I recall pulling my car off  the freeway on                                                                   
     the way  home so that  I could purge  the scream  that I                                                                   
     had been holding  in since that suicidal man  died in my                                                                   
     ear - I was unable to keep him talking "long enough."                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     On a  daily basis,  dispatchers deal  with the worst  of                                                                   
     life's realities.  They talk  with people who are angry,                                                                   
     scared, intoxicated, suicidal,  mentally ill, victims of                                                                   
     domestic  violence and child  abuse.  Occasionally,  the                                                                   
     incomprehensible  occurs - a call  that "hits home."   I                                                                   
     took  the phone  call when  my brother-in-law  committed                                                                   
     suicide.  Two years later, I  was working the radio when                                                                   
     my own husband  shot and killed himself.   I remained on                                                                   
     the radio,  conducting business as usual, until  I could                                                                   
     be relieved.   The possibility  of a dispatcher  dealing                                                                   
     with  an  emergency  involving  friends  and  family  is                                                                   
     highly probable  in Alaska -  which, with the  exception                                                                   
     of Anchorage, is made up of small communities.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
     True dispatchers  are capable of doing this  job because                                                                   
     it  satisfies something  inside them.   They  do it  for                                                                   
     reasons that you can't understand  until you help save a                                                                   
     life or catch  a bad guy.  In my 15 years  of service as                                                                   
     a dispatcher, I  can count my "thank yous"  on one hand.                                                                   
     But  I didn't  do it for  the "thank  yous."   I did  it                                                                   
     because I  was doing  something that I  loved.  I  was a                                                                   
     lifeline to many people and  what I did mattered - and I                                                                   
     didn't need a thank you to know it.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     I am now  the dispatch supervisor for the  Juneau Police                                                                   
     Department   and    no   longer   have    the   hands-on                                                                   
     responsibility of a dispatcher.   I have nothing to gain                                                                   
     personally from  HB 230.  Professionally, as  the person                                                                   
     responsible  for  hiring  qualified people  to  do  this                                                                   
     difficult job, I stand to gain  in my ability to attract                                                                   
     quality  dispatchers and  retain  the experienced  ones.                                                                   
     Good  dispatchers are  difficult to  replace, as it  not                                                                   
     only  takes someone  who  is  able to  do  the job,  but                                                                   
     willing  to do  the  job.   Twenty  years of  cumulative                                                                   
     stress involved  with this job is long enough.   Yet, 20                                                                   
     years is  also short enough  to make it attractive  as a                                                                   
     career choice  and rewarding for those who  have already                                                                   
     dedicated many years of service.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
     With HB 230,  the State of Alaska has an  opportunity to                                                                   
     do   the  just  and   equal  thing;   not  to   discount                                                                   
     dispatchers as  clerical help, but instead  to recognize                                                                   
     dispatchers as  an integral member of the  public safety                                                                   
     and  law   enforcement  team.     Alaska  now   has  the                                                                   
     opportunity to  show their support for  these front-line                                                                   
     workers.  Remember, while you  are spending the holidays                                                                   
     with  family or  sleeping safe  in your  home, they  are                                                                   
     three digits away, and they are always there.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
Number 2429                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN asked if it  would be better for a dispatcher                                                              
to have a shorter  day shift or work week rather  than to work the                                                              
long haul  of 40 hours  per week  for 20 years.   It seems  to him                                                              
that it would  be better if a  dispatcher had a chance  to recoup,                                                              
he added.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MS. CHILDERS said a 20-year retirement  would have been attainable                                                              
for her had the opportunity been  available.  At 15 years' service                                                              
as a  dispatcher, she left  her job.   She enjoyed doing  her work                                                              
but  had  too  much  "emotional baggage"  to  continue.    It  was                                                              
difficult  under  the  circumstances  to  maintain  an  enthusiast                                                              
outlook.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Number 2316                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  OGAN  said  he is  in  favor  of the  proposed  CS                                                              
because  the  dispatchers  work hard  seven  days  a week  and  on                                                              
holidays.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  HUDSON agreed with  Chair James about  portability                                                              
of retirement.   Although  portability  is not  the subject  of HB
230, it is  certainly related to  the policy issue behind  HB 230.                                                              
He believes that if a dispatcher  worked well for five years, then                                                              
started  suffering burn  out, the idea  of retirement  portability                                                              
would allow that employee to take  a break by finding another job,                                                              
he  said.   Eventually,  a dispatcher  would  reach retirement  in                                                              
whatever job was chosen.  He also  believes that other people with                                                              
stressful jobs need relief.  Therefore,  the legislature should be                                                              
prepared to entertain the requests of other employee groups.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Number 2117                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
PAM  PROVOST, an  employee with  the  Anchorage Police  Department                                                              
(APD), representing public safety  dispatchers, testified in favor                                                              
of HB 230.  She said she started  employment with the APD in April                                                              
1979.  As time  went by, she noticed that the  dispatcher turnover                                                              
rate was  extremely high,  so she  gathered statistics  about this                                                              
problem.  She read her testimony as follows:                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     House Bill 230 was introduced  by Judiciary Committee on                                                                   
     May   7,  1999   to   include  the   classification   of                                                                   
     "dispatcher"  in Alaska Statute  AS 39.35.680(28).   The                                                                   
     case   for  including  dispatchers   into  the   20-year                                                                   
     retirement provision is three-part:                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     Job-related   stress  is  not   on  par  with   clerical                                                                   
     positions; our  retirement considerations should  not be                                                                   
     either.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Twenty-year  retirement  will  motivate  dispatchers  to                                                                   
     work  toward  a pension,  allowing  agencies  to  retain                                                                   
     experienced dispatchers.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
     There will  likely be zero cost  to the State  of Alaska                                                                   
     since employees will make up  the PERS contributions for                                                                   
     both the employee and the employer.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     Two  statewide  telephone surveys  were  conducted  this                                                                   
     past  year   in  a  joint   effort  by  Anchorage   area                                                                   
     dispatchers  from   the  Anchorage  Police   Department,                                                                   
     Anchorage  Fire,  Alaska State  Troopers  and  Anchorage                                                                   
     Airport Police.  Some of the  significant findings were:                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
          253 full-time dispatchers are in 30-year PERS                                                                         
          14 full-time dispatchers are in 20-year PERS                                                                          
          92% of the surveyed dispatchers said they would                                                                       
               remain employed in their respective                                                                              
                dispatch centers for 20 years but not for                                                                       
                30 years.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
     The Anchorage Police Department  has experienced ongoing                                                                   
     workplace  turbulence,  as   demonstrated  by  the  high                                                                   
     turnover rate  within the communications center.   As of                                                                   
     December,  1999, eight  employees had  retired from  the                                                                   
     communications center:   three on medical and  the other                                                                   
     five on  aged-based retirement.   Of the five  age-based                                                                   
     retirees,  only  two  maintained  employment  beyond  20                                                                   
     years in the communications center.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     Thirty-six  percent  of all  personnel  assigned to  the                                                                   
     communications  center either quit  or transfer  to less                                                                   
     stressful positions within PERS.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
     Forty  percent of  all new hires  in the  communications                                                                   
     center at APD do not successfully  complete the training                                                                   
     phase of employment.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
     Only four percent of those who  leave the communications                                                                   
     center do so with a PERS pension.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     The Alaska  State legislature appears responsive  to the                                                                   
     needs  of  the  PERS membership,  as  evidenced  by  the                                                                   
     retirement   change   granted  to   adult   correctional                                                                   
     officers in 1990.  PERS was  designed to provide a sound                                                                   
     retirement plan to all its members,  yet the current 30-                                                                   
     year system  fails to encourage employment  longevity in                                                                   
     the communications center.   The criteria for retirement                                                                   
     eligibility  would appear  to have  undermined the  PERS                                                                   
     original  intent.   A revision  to  AS 39.35.680(28)  to                                                                   
     include all  communications center personnel  in 20-year                                                                   
     PERS would further the likelihood  of reversing the high                                                                   
     turnover  in the  stress-laden and  highly complex  work                                                                   
     environment.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     There are  similar efforts being  made in other  states.                                                                   
     Texas   has  a  20-year   retirement  for   dispatchers.                                                                   
     However,  the individual  public safety  agency can  opt                                                                   
     out of that requirement.  Utah  has a 25-year dispatcher                                                                   
     retirement.  However, agency  participation is optional.                                                                   
     California  is attempting  to gain  access to a  20-year                                                                   
     retirement.     However,   there   are  three   distinct                                                                   
     retirement  systems  operating  on  a  statewide  basis,                                                                   
     which unduly complicates the  retirement issue.  Arizona                                                                   
     is  currently drafting  state  certification for  public                                                                   
      safety dispatchers and plans to go forward with a 20-                                                                     
     year retirement effort in the near future.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
MS.  PROVOST  explained  that  APD wants  a  mechanism  to  retain                                                              
trained,  experienced  employees.    She asked  the  committee  to                                                              
equate the $20,000 cost of training  a dispatcher to the actuarial                                                              
contribution  by the  state when  voting on  a 20-year  retirement                                                              
plan for dispatchers.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Number 1834                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR JAMES  emphasized that the  highest cost of payroll  for any                                                              
business is the training and retention of employees.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN inquired as  to the average tenure at present                                                              
of a dispatcher.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MS. PROVOST answered that APD does  have 1995 statistics, but none                                                              
current.  In 1995, dispatcher tenure  was 5.3 years.  Currently at                                                              
APD, 68  percent of  the dispatcher workforce  has less  than five                                                              
years' experience.   Out  of a  squad of  54 dispatchers,  APD has                                                              
four who reached their 20-year anniversary.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Number 1707                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN  said he understands  that APD would  have an                                                              
easier time recruiting if a 20-year retirement was in place.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS. PROVOST answered  yes, adding that APD would  like to minimize                                                              
the need for  training episodes so as to reduce  stress for fellow                                                              
dispatchers.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  HUDSON  said he  understood  that dispatchers  can                                                              
carry their  PERS credit  to another PERS-type  job.  He  asked if                                                              
public safety  personnel can  carry their  retirement credit  to a                                                              
PERS job.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Number 1520                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MS. PROVOST answered  that public safety personnel  are members of                                                              
a different  retirement system than  PERS; the two  systems cannot                                                              
convert.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON commented that  he does not see an advantage                                                              
for  dispatchers  if  they  give  up  portability  of  PERS.    If                                                              
dispatchers are authorized a 20-year  retirement along with public                                                              
safety personnel,  they lose PERS  portability.  He asked  if that                                                              
is what dispatchers really want.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MS. PROVOST explained  that the conversion from PERS  to a 20-year                                                              
plan would  be handled the same  way as when probation  and parole                                                              
officers converted  year-by-year service in  1990 from a 30-  to a                                                              
20-year plan.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Number 1384                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  HUDSON asked  if  a "20  and out"  program can  be                                                              
switched over to a "30 and out" program.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MS.  PROVOST answered  no because  the two  programs stand  alone.                                                              
She said  the APD is  looking for career  dispatchers who  want to                                                              
complete their retirement  program, not people who are  in the job                                                              
to obtain three high[-retirement]  retirement years and move on to                                                              
something else.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   HUDSON   explained   that  if   dispatchers   are                                                              
authorized a "20  and out" program, there is no place  for them to                                                              
go after  they complete  the  20 years.   They can  move from  one                                                              
position  to another  within the  "20 and out"  program, but  they                                                              
cannot  move from  a  "20 and  out"  to a  "30  and out"  program.                                                              
Currently,  a dispatcher can  move into  any other PERS  position.                                                              
He hoped that  dispatchers understood the advantage  they would be                                                              
relinquishing  by joining a  "20 and out"  program.   He suggested                                                              
that perhaps  the committee  needed to make  an amendment  so that                                                              
dispatchers can keep portability of retirement.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Number 1181                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  JAMES  suggested  Representative  Hudson's  argument  would                                                              
defeat the purpose  of the proposed CS.  She  said she understands                                                              
that APD has  spent money training the dispatchers  and wants them                                                              
to stay.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
CONNIE  HETTINGA,  public  safety  dispatcher  for  the  Anchorage                                                              
Police Department,  testified in  favor of HB  230.  She  said she                                                              
has been employed  with APD since June, 1981, and  has worked with                                                              
the dispatcher training program since  1983.  She believes that by                                                              
passing HB 230  dispatcher work would become  professionalized and                                                              
sought after  as a career goal.   She stated that it  is important                                                              
to  the community  that  professional people  be  on duty  because                                                              
dispatchers  work  with  highly technical  equipment  and  issues.                                                              
Also, dispatchers  are required  to deal  with constant  change in                                                              
technology, to know how to use multiple  computer programs, and to                                                              
know   how   to   operate   various    communications   equipment.                                                              
Consequently, she feels that dispatchers are essential workers.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Number 0918                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SMALLEY  inquired as  to the frequency  of required                                                              
overtime and how soon a dispatcher  would be advised that overtime                                                              
was required.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
MS. HETTINGA  answered that  in her experience,  she may  get only                                                              
one  hour's  notice  to  work  overtime  because  the  next  shift                                                              
employee  has called  in  sick or  another  emergency has  arisen.                                                              
Dispatchers have  to be prepared  to fill the dispatcher  position                                                              
at any time and are on recall.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
JULIE  KRAFFT,  Director  of  Member  Services,  Alaska  Municipal                                                              
League (AML), testified  against HB 230.  She said  the purpose of                                                              
her  testimony  is  to  reiterate  the  AML  policy  statement  in                                                              
opposition to any  legislation that increases the cost  of PERS or                                                              
the Teachers' Retirement System due  to increased benefits.  Their                                                              
issue is financing.   She understands from Mr.  Bell's explanation                                                              
that HB  230 would increase  employer costs.   If the  proposed CS                                                              
made HB 230 revenue-neutral,  then AML would have  no objection to                                                              
HB 230 since AML's goal is to keep tax levels down.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Number 0699                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  JAMES explained  that there  is a  proposed CS  for HB  230                                                              
before the  committee.  She believes  it is the  responsibility of                                                              
the  legislature  to provide  services  for  the public  that  the                                                              
public  wants  and needs  at  the  least  possible expense.    She                                                              
reminded the committee that one testifier  today had explained how                                                              
much it  costs to train  dispatchers; therefore, Chair  James said                                                              
she is convinced that a savings in  training dollars and retention                                                              
of employees  will result from HB  230, even though there  will be                                                              
increased employer  costs due to the retirement  fund contribution                                                              
rate.   She  suggested AML's  opposition  due to  a cost  increase                                                              
should be  reconsidered in the  light of real savings  outweighing                                                              
employer cost.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
MS. KRAFFT responded  that the proposed CS has been  sent to AML's                                                              
revenue and  finance subcommittee  for discussion.   She suspected                                                              
that AML's  policy committee  may come to  the same conclusion  as                                                              
Chair James,  she said,  especially after  listening to  testimony                                                              
about  the difficulties  that dispatchers  endure  in their  jobs.                                                              
However, at the present time AML must follow its policy.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Number 0368                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
KIM  MARTIN,  police  officer,  Juneau  Police  Department  (JPD),                                                              
testified in  favor of  HB 230.   A police  dispatcher at  JPD for                                                              
eight  years,  she  agreed  with   previous  testifiers  that  the                                                              
dispatcher position should be a career.   She wants people to make                                                              
a commitment  to the job and to  keep the experience for  the sake                                                              
of public  safety.  Ms.  Martin explained that  police dispatchers                                                              
deal  with  secondary   traumatic  stress.    She   recounted  how                                                              
dispatchers  work  in  an  enclosed room,  stuck  to  a  telephone                                                              
headset and  a computer.   She feels that  not being able  to move                                                              
during an emergency situation definitely  affects the dispatchers'                                                              
health  because they  go  through all  the  emotions of  traumatic                                                              
stress and yet have no way of defusing  stress as police officers,                                                              
who can take action, do.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Number 0129                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
JOSEPH   CROSS,  Communications   Supervisor,  Dillingham   Police                                                              
Department, testified  via teleconference from  Dillingham, saying                                                              
he  has observed  firsthand  the  stress levels  that  dispatchers                                                              
endure.  He believes  that extremely high stress  levels and a 30-                                                              
year retirement  plan causes high  turnover.  Even  though working                                                              
conditions  are good in  Dillingham, the  30-year retirement  plan                                                              
causes about  one opening  per year; indeed,  he has  a dispatcher                                                              
position open  right now because  the previous dispatcher  found a                                                              
better position.  His dispatcher  training program takes 12 weeks;                                                              
he agreed  with previous  testifiers that  dispatcher training  is                                                              
costly.   He envisions that the  20-year retirement plan  would be                                                              
positive for dispatchers.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON  made a motion to move CSHB  230, version 1-                                                              
LS0958/D,  Cramer, 1/11/00,  from  committee with  recommendations                                                              
and the  attached fiscal  note.   There being  no objection,  CSHB
230(STA) moved from the House State Affairs Standing Committee.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
TAPE 00-4, SIDE A                                                                                                               
Number 0020                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
HB 315-ONLINE SYSTEM REPLACES AK ADMIN JOURNAL                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Number 0454                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR JAMES  announced the  next order of  business is  HOUSE BILL                                                              
NO.  315,   "An  Act  relating   to  elimination  of   the  Alaska                                                              
Administrative Journal and instituting  public notice requirements                                                              
on the Alaska Online Public Notice  System; amending public notice                                                              
publication  requirements for certain  regulations; and  providing                                                              
for an effective date."                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
JOHN LINDBACK, Chief of Staff, Office  of the Lieutenant Governor,                                                              
read the following sponsor statement for HB 315:                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     The  Alaska  Administrative  Journal  has  served  as  a                                                                   
     compilation of  public notices from state  agencies, the                                                                   
     great  majority  of  which   are  also  required  to  be                                                                   
     published in the print or broadcast media.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
     Alaska   Administrative   Journal   subscribership   has                                                                   
     dramatically   declined  with   the   advent  of   state                                                                   
     government  making information  available to the  public                                                                   
     on the  Internet.   When Lt.  Governor Ulmer first  took                                                                   
     office, there  were about 125 paying subscribers  ($90 a                                                                   
     year).  Subscribership has dropped  to nine out-of-state                                                                   
     businesses.   On June 4,  1999, Governor Knowles  signed                                                                   
     Administrative  Order  183,  which  requires  all  state                                                                   
     agencies to post statutorily  required public notices on                                                                   
     the  new  Online  Public  Notice  system.    The  system                                                                   
     provides the  public with a  convenient way to  find all                                                                   
     public notices in one place  on the state web page.  The                                                                   
     Online Public  Notice website is organized  in a similar                                                                   
     format to the Alaska Administrative Journal.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     This legislation  would eliminate  the requirement  that                                                                   
     the   Lt.   Governor's   Office   produce   the   Alaska                                                                   
     Administrative   Journal   and   replace   it   with   a                                                                   
     requirement that  the Lt. Governor provide  oversight of                                                                   
     the Online  Public Notice system.  It  requires agencies                                                                   
     by statute  to post their  public notices in  the Online                                                                   
     Public Notice system.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     The legislation  has a  zero fiscal  note.  It  replaces                                                                   
     one responsibility with another.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MR. LINDBACK noted  that one reason for Administrative  Order 183,                                                              
which establishes the Online Public  Notice system, was that state                                                              
agencies  were publishing  notices  on their  separate web  pages,                                                              
making it  difficult for an  ordinary citizen to  navigate through                                                              
every  public notice  posted.    Using the  Alaska  Administrative                                                              
Journal as a model, the Online Public  Notice system would put all                                                              
state public notices  in one place.  Mr. Lindback  emphasized that                                                              
everything contained  in the Alaska Administrative  Journal is now                                                              
published on computer  by the Online Public Notice  system.  Since                                                              
September 15, 1999,  the web site has been visited  15,000 times -                                                              
an  average  of  100  visits  per  day.   He  noted  that  HB  315                                                              
eliminates  all   references  in  state  statute   to  the  Alaska                                                              
Administrative  Journal  and  inserts  references  to  the  Online                                                              
Public Notice system.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Number 0723                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE OGAN  said he thinks it  is a great idea  but asked                                                              
why the fiscal note is zero.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Number 0774                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MR. LINDBACK said he believes it  takes the same amount of time to                                                              
prepare the Online Public Notice  system as it does to publish the                                                              
Alaska Administrative Journal.  Therefore,  the fiscal note for HB
315 is zero.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Number 0780                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE OGAN  asked if anyone's  interests will be  hurt by                                                              
HB  315 because  not  everyone has  a  computer  connected to  the                                                              
Internet.  He  wanted to know how those people  or businesses will                                                              
get access to the Online Public Notice system.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
MR.  LINDBACK  answered  no.    Currently,   only  nine  companies                                                              
subscribe  to the  Alaska Administrative  Journal;  all the  other                                                              
subscribers have switched over to  the Online Public Notice system                                                              
to retrieve  public  notices in which  they are  interested.   Mr.                                                              
Lindback reminded the committee that  all libraries in Alaska have                                                              
computers  for public  use, so  anyone  who wants  to monitor  the                                                              
Online Public Notice  system can get access at the  libraries.  He                                                              
said all state agencies now use the Online Public Notice system.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Number 0899                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  HUDSON  asked  if  the Office  of  the  Lieutenant                                                              
Governor  had  advised  subscribers or  solicited  their  opinions                                                              
regarding the proposed change.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
Number 0948                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MR. LINDBACK answered  that the Office of the  Lieutenant Governor                                                              
had advised  people that the  Alaska Administrative  Journal would                                                              
be published  online at no  charge to the  reader.  At  present, a                                                              
subscription  to the  journal costs  $90.  People  have also  been                                                              
advised about the new Online Public  Notice system, which contains                                                              
the same  information as  the Alaska  Administrative Journal.   By                                                              
passing HB  315, the  Office of the  Lieutenant Governor  hopes to                                                              
eliminate double posting of public notices.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Number 0990                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  HUDSON   noted  that  the  Alaska   Administrative                                                              
Journal subscribers were depositing  $90 per year into the general                                                              
fund.  Since  there were 125 subscribers, that  means about $9,000                                                              
will no longer be contributed to state accounts receivable.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE OGAN asked if the  governor has executive authority                                                              
to  mandate  this  kind  of  request  without  going  through  the                                                              
legislative process.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MR. LINDBACK indicated the governor cannot delete a statute.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Number 1109                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  HUDSON commented  that  the Alaska  Administrative                                                              
Journal is mandated by statute.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  JAMES  agreed  that  deleting   the  Alaska  Administrative                                                              
Journal does require a statutory change.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Number 1234                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE OGAN  made a motion to move HB  315 with individual                                                              
recommendations and the attached  [zero] fiscal note.  There being                                                              
no objection, HB  315 moved from the House State  Affairs Standing                                                              
Committee.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
ADJOURNMENT                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
There being  no further business  before the committee,  the House                                                              
State Affairs  Standing  Committee meeting  was adjourned  at 9:55                                                              
a.m.                                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                

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